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Dave S. Quire's avatar

I think it was Charles Murray who compared IQ scores to the weight of offensive lineman - there's a minimum threshold that you need to meet to really compete at the higher levels, but once you pass that threshold, more does not correlate at all with higher performance. Winning at those higher levels requires those things that are difficult or impossible to measure, the intangibles, that being "on fire with thought"... or to carry on the football analogy, being on fire with pushing those other dudes out of the way.

Scott Alexander's avatar

I agree with the main point of this post (attempts to judge famous people's IQs are garbage, IQ of 160 is basically unmeasurable), but I think along the way it gets some things importantly wrong.

1. It uses the word IQ in a way that equivocates between "score on an IQ test" and "g, the thing IQ tests measure". Many of its points don't make sense once you remove that equivocation. For example, it's not true that nobody's IQ is 160. Certainly some people get scores of 160 on IQ tests. And some people are four standard deviations from the mean on g. It's just that they're probably not the same people, or we can't say with confidence that they are.

2. Likewise, when you say "IQ is changeable", you mean "score on IQ tests". This is no more interesting than saying that height "is changeable" because you can stand on your tiptoes when they're measuring you, or wear platform shoes. g doesn't seem to be changeable, or at least it would take much more evidence to convince me that it was.

3. The part about benefits of high IQ vanishing past a certain point is probably wrong. The study you cite has some issues and is contradicted by other studies; see Link 23 at https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/links-for-march-2023 for directions to some other places that can explain the problems better than I can.

4. I don't have an airtight retort to the Einstein story except to ask whether you think it would be fair to say Einstein "wasn't very good at math". "Good at math" seems to be the sort of thing which is heavily correlated with math grades and math test scores, in the same way that mathematical IQ is correlated with math grades and math test scores. So I see only two options. First, Einstein wasn't very good at math (this doesn't seem impossible to me, maybe he just worked really hard, got enough math to do physics at all, and was truly exceptional in some other area like creativity). Second, he was good at math, but he found his classes boring or oppressive, didn't try very hard, and so his grades don't reflect his talent very well. I think switching from the mystical-sounding word "IQ" to the normal-sounding words "good at math" help prime our intuition here and make the second possibility seem pretty likely. See https://www.openculture.com/2020/04/albert-einsteins-grades-a-fascinating-look-at-his-report-cards.html for more evidence that this is true.

That having been said, I think Kasparov had a real IQ test and it was 135. It wouldn't surprise me if top-in-the-world-at-something geniuses often had about IQ 135 because their skill is only modestly correlated with IQ. My guess is that some geniuses will be around 135 (because they're using something like creativity to succeed) and others will be higher (because they're using raw intelligence).

Hopefully someone smarter than me will come along soon to address some of the other points.

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